Sydney School for Self Knowledge

Discussion of the SES' satellite schools in Australia and New Zealand.
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Joined: Sat Jun 23, 2012 9:00 pm

Re: Sydney School for Self Knowledge

Postby Leonie » Thu Jul 18, 2013 6:09 pm

Thank you for your informative posts sydneykatieking. How you doing?

Best wishes, Leonie

Posts: 151
Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2009 1:37 pm

Re: Sydney School for Self Knowledge

Postby Tootsie » Sat Aug 24, 2013 7:42 am

Could somebody please explain why a Guru is necessary when learning meditation? Take TM for instance which requires a weeks wages for the secret manta which can simply be found by goggling Transcendental Meditations mantra. The mantras are given according to ones age its as simple as that, so if you are 45 years old your mantra is hirim. Why would anyone pay maharishi $1500 for a word? If you go to India mantras are not secret, they are on flags, walls or chanted aloud. Gandhi died with his mantra Ram on his lips.

To me meditation means focusing ones attention on something which could be the breath or the body or a word. This takes one away from ones thoughts which most of us are focused on and we are burning energy all day. I find that focusing on the breath is natural because breathing is something that is always there. Anyway its works for me!

As a money making franchise selling mantras are equivalent to the old snake oil salesmen. There is nothing wrong with quietening the mind but taking money for it, IMHO is wrong.

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Location: UK

Re: Sydney School for Self Knowledge

Postby Dr.Alan » Sat Aug 24, 2013 8:58 pm

Hi Tootsie,
You are 100% correct in your sentiments about paying for a mantra. "why would anyone pay the Maharishi $1.500 for a word."

The Indian tradition is summed up thus. " 'The guru who charges or takes money from his disciples in return for initiation, steals disciples property and goes to damnable hell.' For that reason His Divinity Shri Guru Deva used to give 'upadesha' (initiation with a mantra) without any fees. He used to say 'If I accept any gift from the disciple (or fees), then his sins are transmitted to me.' In India, dharma, yoga, knowledge, specialized knowledge can never be sold for money. That is priceless. Anyone who puts a price on it insults it. So, a mantra is also never given for money. Knowledge cannot be sold for money."

We can therefore presume that those who charge money are not acting strictly in accordance with the ancient tradition. This would also put some doubt on the efficacy of the mantras which they dispense, and the method with which they give it.

However, with regard to the value of a mantra, it might help if you think about the difference between trying to learn a craft such as felt making for example, from a book. It may be possible to do it. And there are people who can gain sufficient understanding this way. But for those who are not so capable, they would find that to hear the instructions from a competent person who has learned the craft well, can give you a better feel for it, and quicker, than a book may do. Also to get a hands-on lesson with explanation of each step and the reason for it, may give you an advantage over the clever person who can learn from the book. (who will still need to go through a trial and error process maybe.)

The above is an example of a physical craft or skill. Meditation, as you rightly explain, is to do with the mind. Which is not such an easy thing for many of us to understand. Hence, to receive a mantra from a person who knows, when, how, where etc. to pass it on, may well prove to be a more beneficial way to receive it.

If a mother shoves food in front of her children with a bad attitude and shouts and complains at them all the time about the way they eat, how much or how little they eat etc. etc. bringing them into a negative frame of mind when eating -- then it is certain that the process of eating will not be such a pleasant and beneficial thing for them. Experiments have been done about this subject with children and food. And it has been shown that children who are given the same food but in a loving, conducive and pleasant background , do benefit more from that food.

Transfer this concept to the receiving of a mantra, and it may be possible to understand that the manner and circumstances in which it is given are all the more important about that thing which is given.

Then there is the story of the gem-stone and the man who tried to get it valued - which clearly shows that it is the person's attitude who receives it that gives the mantra its real value (but I will save that story for another time) I am sure you have heard enough from me by now.

Best wishes

Dr. Alan
SES - London 1964-1974 left due to SES interference with private life.

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